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Mottled Peacock Tails


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#1 Downdaline

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Posted 23 November 2016 - 10:15 PM

I'm looking for a select pair with 3" or longer barbs. I don't have much to trade but would happily pay by check or money order. Thanks for helping.
Dave Batchelor
517 927 1977

#2 Barkworth

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Posted 23 November 2016 - 10:36 PM

I have bought quite a lot of Peacock, as some of them have barring that makes for a very good Great Bustard sub, but I never got over 2.5 inches. As a consequence, I don't think that mottled Peacock comes in 3 inches or bigger, so your inquiry made me want to ask if you have ever seen them that big?

Cheers,
Robert


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#3 buggybob

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Posted 23 November 2016 - 11:08 PM

Peacocks don't have a normal tail like other birds, the vast majority of the "tail" is the eyed herl sticks with a layer of gray support quills behind.  I've never seen the support quills in any color other than gray. If you are talking about wing quill secondaries, Robert is right, it is very difficult, impossible is more like it, to find anything longer that 2.5 inches.



#4 Downdaline

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Posted 23 November 2016 - 11:35 PM

My mistake, I meant wings not tail. Looking for a select pair of mottled peacock WING feathers with 3 inch or longer barbs.
The pair of tail feathers I am looking for with 3 inch or longer barbs is golden pheasant.
Sorry for the mistake. Thanks for any help you can provide. BTW have already checked with feathersmc on the GP tail no luck.
Dave Batchelor
517 927 1977

#5 Classic Salmon Fly Tyer

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Posted 24 November 2016 - 12:53 PM

Dave,

 

I just looked at all of my peacock secondaries which I will say are top notch quality...and the best of them max out at 2.5".

 

As far as the Golden Pheasant is concerned, the only stuff I've ever seen at close to the 3" mark is Amgold Pheasant which is a Golden/Amherst hybrid I believe.

 

To be honest you are looking for something we'd all like to find and have in our selection of materials.

 

Good Luck with your material hunt !!!!

 

Cheers,

George


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George

 

"I've spent many days on the golf course and said I should have gone fishing.

But I've NEVER been on a trout stream or Atlantic Salmon river and said I should have played golf." - Me


#6 Ephemerella

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Posted 24 November 2016 - 03:25 PM

Unlikely you will find peacock wing over 2 1/4" fiber length. Perhaps try subbing with dark tricolor penciled palm turkey tail. Unfortunately I only have the bi-color (dark gray and pale tan).

-Peter



#7 jgogg

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Posted 25 November 2016 - 03:06 PM

As others have said before me, you are searching for unobtainium. Peacock wings don't have 3" barbs. And while pure Golden pheasant tails might get that long, you may well find hen's teeth first.  Dave Carne had a perfectly valid point about the size of materials a while back which I will paraphrase for you; if the materials are not large enough for the hook you are trying to use, your hook is too damn big.

 

This certainly applies to the tying of proper classics with the proper materials.  If you simply want to tie large display flies, then the thing to do is discover suitable substitutes.  Keep in mind that there will be no censor to tell you that "you have done it wrong".  Once you decide to alter a pattern, either by materials or style, it is all up to your discretion and pleasure.  The most anyone can say is "I wouldn't have done it that way".  Also keep in mind that "standard patterns" were frequently standardized by the commercial tying operations.  Individual hobbyists have ALWAYS been pleased to modify patterns to suit their own tastes, their ideas on the tastes of salmon, and the exigencies of their tying kit.

 

For the two you are looking for, there are varieties of turkey with 3+" barbs that look very much like peacock wing when you are using a few barbs in a wing.  And when Goldens are bred with Amherst, then bred back so that the bird is about 3/4 Golden, you can wind up with center tail feathers with Golden markings and Amherst barb length.  These are sometimes available, although expensive!   Check with John McLain.


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#8 Classic Salmon Fly Tyer

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Posted 25 November 2016 - 03:30 PM

As others have said before me, you are searching for unobtainium. Peacock wings don't have 3" barbs. And while pure Golden pheasant tails might get that long, you may well find hen's teeth first.  Dave Carne had a perfectly valid point about the size of materials a while back which I will paraphrase for you; if the materials are not large enough for the hook you are trying to use, your hook is too damn big.

 

This certainly applies to the tying of proper classics with the proper materials.  If you simply want to tie large display flies, then the thing to do is discover suitable substitutes.  Keep in mind that there will be no censor to tell you that "you have done it wrong".  Once you decide to alter a pattern, either by materials or style, it is all up to your discretion and pleasure.  The most anyone can say is "I wouldn't have done it that way".  Also keep in mind that "standard patterns" were frequently standardized by the commercial tying operations.  Individual hobbyists have ALWAYS been pleased to modify patterns to suit their own tastes, their ideas on the tastes of salmon, and the exigencies of their tying kit.

 

For the two you are looking for, there are varieties of turkey with 3+" barbs that look very much like peacock wing when you are using a few barbs in a wing.  And when Goldens are bred with Amherst, then bred back so that the bird is about 3/4 Golden, you can wind up with center tail feathers with Golden markings and Amherst barb length.  These are sometimes available, although expensive!   Check with John McLain.

Your commentary makes so much sense Jim...and I too remember Dave's thoughts on materials and size of the fly&hook. I also have said many times before and I agree totally with your thoughts on personal touches and style to whatever anyone may tie. It is supposed to be fun.

Cheers,

George


Petri Heil,

George

 

"I've spent many days on the golf course and said I should have gone fishing.

But I've NEVER been on a trout stream or Atlantic Salmon river and said I should have played golf." - Me


#9 jgogg

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Posted 25 November 2016 - 03:37 PM

An interesting factoid about "peacock tails";  the actual tail feathers on a peacock are those stiff grey feathers behind the glorious eyed train.  The train itself are modified saddle (back) feathers.  

 

Judy Lehmberg is pleased to dye the tail feathers and use them as a substitute for swan.  This is a bit tricky to do with lighter colors, as the tails on a typical India blue or Java green peacock are pretty dark.  But, should you come across a white peacock, this can work quite well.  I once bought a dyed set of white peacock tail feathers from a veterinarian that had access to some white birds. 


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#10 Chris Knox

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Posted 28 November 2016 - 03:50 PM

yup 100% what James said. Jens used to say the same as Dave- nature is nature, and that's the length you get given.

 

C


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#11 arkle

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Posted 29 November 2016 - 05:51 PM

Albino/white peacock are not usually that difficult to find.



#12 jgogg

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Posted 30 November 2016 - 08:47 PM

Albino/white peacock are not usually that difficult to find.

Yep.  I purchased a white peacock skin on ebay for less than $100.00.  They turn up regularly.  What you do not often see is Java Green skins....


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#13 Gordeaux

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Posted 09 February 2017 - 03:25 PM

Good luck finding 3 inch barbs.  I bought a whole peacock from Jens Pilgard years go that was 10 feet long from the head to the end of the tail and it didn't have 3 inch barbs and that was a very mature peacock.



#14 jgogg

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Posted 09 February 2017 - 09:21 PM

To further beat this dead horse; if you must make a married feather wing using peacock wing, that wing will be 2 1/2" max.  Find a hook that a wing this size will look proportional on and use it.  If you must make a 3" wing to suit a particular hook, find a substitute for the peacock wing.  As mentioned, there are turkey tails patterned such that a few barbs are nearly indistinguishable from peacock.  And while it is not hard to distinguish peacock from bustard, I am fond of making that substitute in wings that don't already have bustard in them.  In fact, I'm not clear on why every married wing doesn't have some bustard in it....it works wonders.  On the other hand, if you like to frustrate yourself, make married wings with only Amherst and Golden tails.


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